I bought a '66 R60/2 that hadn't been run in several years. I'm getting conflicting opinions the
oil slingers. Some say that the motor should be disassembled and the slingers cleaned.
Others have told me to but a high detergent oil in, run the bike for 100-150 miles and then drain
the oil. The contaminants would be removed by the high detergent oil. Still others have told me
to ignore the slingers, just use good oil and change the oil frequently.
Does anyone have experience with this situation? Any help appreciated.
/2 Slingers
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J. Stracco
Re: /2 Slingers
Everything I have read or seen, suggests dismantling the engine and cleaning the slingers
by hand. The sediment in the slingers can be a hard clay like substance which has to be
picked out. I really can't imagine it dissolving in oil, especially because it is constantly exposed to oil.
You can try the high detergent oil, but I can't see how you would be able to tell if it were effective
My bike is apart right now. It was disassembled to have the slingers cleaned, but it allowed
me to right several other problems which I wasn't aware of. For instance the main bearing seats were worn,
so I had them replated and ground. It is also an opportunity for you to upgrade parts if you want.
I added a lightweight clutch flywheel. You may want to consider this as an opportunity to
perform such an upgrade.
by hand. The sediment in the slingers can be a hard clay like substance which has to be
picked out. I really can't imagine it dissolving in oil, especially because it is constantly exposed to oil.
You can try the high detergent oil, but I can't see how you would be able to tell if it were effective
My bike is apart right now. It was disassembled to have the slingers cleaned, but it allowed
me to right several other problems which I wasn't aware of. For instance the main bearing seats were worn,
so I had them replated and ground. It is also an opportunity for you to upgrade parts if you want.
I added a lightweight clutch flywheel. You may want to consider this as an opportunity to
perform such an upgrade.
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J. Stracco
More /2 Slingers
I should add that it's reccommended that you clean your slingers every
20-30K miles. They basically act as a centrifugal force oil filter. If you don't clean them
oil distribution will become fouled and you will damage your engine through oil starvation.
Check out this site for more info: http://members.aol.com/VechBMW/index.html
Vech has a section within his site explaining the need to clean your slingers.
20-30K miles. They basically act as a centrifugal force oil filter. If you don't clean them
oil distribution will become fouled and you will damage your engine through oil starvation.
Check out this site for more info: http://members.aol.com/VechBMW/index.html
Vech has a section within his site explaining the need to clean your slingers.
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Michele Varcasia
Re: /2 Slingers
Steve, I have your same problem on my R50: no way to now the story of the bike except it has been stopped for 20 years and no original odometer. It runs smooth and well and , to me, it is a real pity to put down that engine without evident reason .
A thought : modern oil are really really better than the older ones, so, the condition of the slinger could not become worse than they are.
Another thought: why the BMW manual don't say anything about this manteinance operation ? and they were written when the oil quality was't like now.
I would like to read more on this.
Michele
A thought : modern oil are really really better than the older ones, so, the condition of the slinger could not become worse than they are.
Another thought: why the BMW manual don't say anything about this manteinance operation ? and they were written when the oil quality was't like now.
I would like to read more on this.
Michele
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Pierre Michaud
Re: /2 Slingers
Steve,
I purchased a 1968 R69S last November and when I started restoration I went through the same questions you have. I finally decided to open it up and found that the slingers were packed to the brim and the rear bearing had started to be oil starved. You really need to remove the crank to remove the crud. You actually need a dental pick to get at it. No detergent in the world will dissolve it without mechanical intervention. The only thing that the new oils will do for you is increase the service time between slinger cleanups. The crud in my 2 slingers filled a metal cylindrical container that is 2 inches in diameter by 0.5 inches thick. Had the previous owner cleaned the slingers in time I would not have had to get 2 new main bearings and a connecting rod replaced (big end race wear).
So do it!
I purchased a 1968 R69S last November and when I started restoration I went through the same questions you have. I finally decided to open it up and found that the slingers were packed to the brim and the rear bearing had started to be oil starved. You really need to remove the crank to remove the crud. You actually need a dental pick to get at it. No detergent in the world will dissolve it without mechanical intervention. The only thing that the new oils will do for you is increase the service time between slinger cleanups. The crud in my 2 slingers filled a metal cylindrical container that is 2 inches in diameter by 0.5 inches thick. Had the previous owner cleaned the slingers in time I would not have had to get 2 new main bearings and a connecting rod replaced (big end race wear).
So do it!
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Allan Atherton
Re: /2 Slingers
Michele,
The could be two fallacies in your reasoning:
1. Modern hi-detergent oils may only succeed in keeping more sludge in suspension instead of at the bottom of the pan, so more sludge is available for the slingers to centrufuge out of the oil.
2. Waiting until you hear the damage only adds a lot more parts and labor cost to what would be only a labor cost.
When you acquire a /2 that you intend to keep and run for a long time, you must either know the condition of the slingers (i.e. when last cleaned), or check them yourself. Otherwise, figure on riding the /2 until you hear the wear problems, and them either you fix them, or sell to the next owner at a discount so he can fix them.
The could be two fallacies in your reasoning:
1. Modern hi-detergent oils may only succeed in keeping more sludge in suspension instead of at the bottom of the pan, so more sludge is available for the slingers to centrufuge out of the oil.
2. Waiting until you hear the damage only adds a lot more parts and labor cost to what would be only a labor cost.
When you acquire a /2 that you intend to keep and run for a long time, you must either know the condition of the slingers (i.e. when last cleaned), or check them yourself. Otherwise, figure on riding the /2 until you hear the wear problems, and them either you fix them, or sell to the next owner at a discount so he can fix them.
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Michele Varcasia
Re: /2 Slingers
I am trying to explicate:
1) if you buy a unknow condition, but well running bike, I suggest to make several oil change with high detergent oil (max 20-30 km runs each) and the slunge in the engine would go off with the oil (of course not the hard sludge in the slingers, which remain in the same conditions as they were!! for example half full of sludge but not filled). In this condition the rods are not oil starving because the holes are not closed (remember, the bike is running well).
At this moment , using a new brand mineral oil instead of the high detergent, and changing it frequently (max 1000 miles) , could not get the things worse.
Of course, it could be the clean the slinger, but , you know, everytime you work on an old engine, to repair one thing you could break another.....
1) if you buy a unknow condition, but well running bike, I suggest to make several oil change with high detergent oil (max 20-30 km runs each) and the slunge in the engine would go off with the oil (of course not the hard sludge in the slingers, which remain in the same conditions as they were!! for example half full of sludge but not filled). In this condition the rods are not oil starving because the holes are not closed (remember, the bike is running well).
At this moment , using a new brand mineral oil instead of the high detergent, and changing it frequently (max 1000 miles) , could not get the things worse.
Of course, it could be the clean the slinger, but , you know, everytime you work on an old engine, to repair one thing you could break another.....
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Allan Atherton
Re: /2 Slingers
Michele,
I think there are some misconceptions in your understanding of the slingers and the holes and will email you directly.
I think there are some misconceptions in your understanding of the slingers and the holes and will email you directly.
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D. Meyer
Re: /2 Slingers
Michael and all,
I am a new owner of a 1968 R50/2 with 22000 orig. miles. I tore into it as part of a restoration and believe me I will ride comfortably after seeing the crud in the slingers.
If I recall, the BMW factory manual suggests a cleaning at 30 - 40000 miles(I think). They probably did not address this issue as much because we are just now seeing these 30+ year old bikes taken down and those that had higher mileage at the time probably had much more attention than those we are finding in various states after 30 years. It is all because of the unknown. Michael, I will now care for my machine in such a way that in 40000 miles I will not be as concerned about the buildup. So, low mileage over time is not really a virtue.
I am a new owner of a 1968 R50/2 with 22000 orig. miles. I tore into it as part of a restoration and believe me I will ride comfortably after seeing the crud in the slingers.
If I recall, the BMW factory manual suggests a cleaning at 30 - 40000 miles(I think). They probably did not address this issue as much because we are just now seeing these 30+ year old bikes taken down and those that had higher mileage at the time probably had much more attention than those we are finding in various states after 30 years. It is all because of the unknown. Michael, I will now care for my machine in such a way that in 40000 miles I will not be as concerned about the buildup. So, low mileage over time is not really a virtue.
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K. Munger
Re: /2 Slingers
The error in Michele's thinking is the misconception that the slingers are full of sludge. As explained in Vech's article (mentioned earlier in the string), the slingers catch all the tiny bits of metal that are suspended in the oil. These particles would be removed by the oil filter if only the engine had one. Once the slingers fill, the particles back up into the bearing.
This is a bad thing.
Does the owners manual give the time period for ANY periodic maintainance that involves tearing the entire engine down (i.e. main bearing replacement, or even top end work such as ring and valve jobs)? That's what service manuals and/or dealer mechanics are for. What kind of logic is it to ignore the factory service manual recommendation because the owners manual didn't mention it?
Accept the painful truth. Not cleaning the slingers is like never changing the oil filter in an engine. No matter how good your oil is, eventually it will lead to major damage and big bucks.
This is a bad thing.
Does the owners manual give the time period for ANY periodic maintainance that involves tearing the entire engine down (i.e. main bearing replacement, or even top end work such as ring and valve jobs)? That's what service manuals and/or dealer mechanics are for. What kind of logic is it to ignore the factory service manual recommendation because the owners manual didn't mention it?
Accept the painful truth. Not cleaning the slingers is like never changing the oil filter in an engine. No matter how good your oil is, eventually it will lead to major damage and big bucks.